Updated OCZ PC4000 VX memory review/comparison

1) You stated above that Winbond makes 2 diff versions, a bh and a ch quality, but does not mark them. You then go and state that most of the new UTT are build by Infineon for Winbond. That last statement confuses me. Does Infineon make these or does Winbond? I've seen copies of news release dated back to August of 2004 which stated that Winbond was selling the excess capacity which was not purchased by Infineon in the open market as unmarked (UTT) chips. Who is doing the manufacturing for whom here? Did you intend to say that the UTT was built for Infineon by Winbond?

winbond is a fabless manufacturer. they contracted with infineon to build for the. infineon builds it based on winbond specs and quality control.

2) You stated that there are two versions...is there one that has the "legendary" Winbond dimples (like the TwinMOS Speed Premiums have) and one without (like the recently released OCZ Value VX which has no dimples) or is this packaging merely an exterior without any meaning to it?

the ch at the beginning of 2005 has no dimples. the bh/ch starting this month has 2 dots/ dimples


3) Next...just what do you mean by a bh and a ch quality? I know that Winbond does not MARK/LABEL the chips, but are they being manufactured based on the old bh vs ch dyes?

bh/ ch quaity is are made with different dye processes. i am not sure if it based on the old dyes thus we have been doing a lot of testing.

4) Since there is a connection to Infineon in all of this...does Infineon sell a product using these (Winbond produced or Infineon produced) chips. In other words, are there Infineon labeled chips out there with these same characteristics as the "Winbond UTT" and if so, are you guys using any of them?

not that we have seen...

Duonger

Thanks again Duonger.

-Collin-

deception`` said:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=56685&page=7&pp=25

The CL2 dual pack at Fry's/Outpost is now guarunteed Bh-5. Here is a direct link so you can get your plastic ready:

http://shop4.outpost.com/product/3602905?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

deception``

Click to expand...

Maybe it's just me, but the reults in the thread above seem horrible to me. I wouldn't waste my money on them.

I need to know what "BH quality" ram works like..... just order $127.20..... so what.... I didn't want to save money this month anyway...... I can start over with saving money next month..... They'll be here next monday or tuesday (which I have off) so I can play around with them then....

If you read through the thread, you would see the same guy with bad results kept getting better and better once he played with them. Never read too much into initial results ... take it as a whole.

Thanks for the information, Duonger. Is there any way to discern BH IC's from CH ones on various manufacturers?

I'm assuming the OCZ VX's are using ones from the BH process, given their rated speeds, timings, and voltages, which is why I'm probably going to pick up a set in the future. But I'd sure like to know how to tell the difference between other marketers, as well.

Duonger,

Many thanks for answering my questions so quickly and completely. It is appreciated.

PerlAddict,

This is what OCZ is doing, per ryanpgroovy's over at XS.

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New OCZ BH-5 and VX , what to expect

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I just wanted to make a few notes concerning some of the new OCZ products so that people have a fair idea of what there getting , And what speeds to expect , so I will make a quick list


OCZ " Value VX " PC-3200 Value with winbond UTT - ( should be priced around 130-140 USD )

This product is only tested for the value specification , but uses winbond utt, a very high percentage will do 220-240 with the right voltage , with I would guess half overall do above 240 ( 2-2-2 ). A small percentage will do 2-2-2 at 2.85-2.9 volts ( these are lucky sticks , not the norm )
if your trying to squeeze a few extra Mhz try 2-3-2

OCZ PC-3200 VX ( 2nd lowest in pricing about 200USD now and dropping )

You guys should know what to expect now , but I will state it for the record
these do on average 240 , many people after burn in get higher I have seen 250-260 ( I am sure not many do 260 ) , if your getting over 250 dont trade these in for VX-4000 , it just not a good deal if your trying to squeeze a few extra Mhz try 2-3-2


OCZ-4000 VX ( price should be dropping )

These should do at least the specification , but these of course dont have the same overhead the VX-3200 do , they are meant for those who want to hit 250 minimum, now some percentage of these will do 260 or even 265 after burn in , but thats not certain , only a very small percentage of the WB UTT chips meet our test specification for VX-4000.


OCZ PC-3200 Gold 2-2-2 ( should be priced less than PC-3200 plat rev 2 )

New Product using BH die , does 2-2-2 at 2.85 , higher speeds at higher voltages are possible but we dont screen for those , we screen for 2-2-2 at the lowest voltage


For those of you who have asked , where do all the lower performing chips go
most end up in these products.

OCZ PC-3200 Value ( not listed as a winbond chip )
OCZ PC-2700 performance


Just wanted to make sure everyone knows what to expect.

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end of quote...source:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=56898

Thinking of picking up a set of TwinMos Speed Premium and a Mushkin blue twin pack to play with. I need to upgrade the ram on two of my PCs so they will find a home. Haven't been able to find the TwinMos SP at my normal shopping places though.

Just like to point out that the SINGLE 512mb stick of Mushkin Blue CL2 ram performed much better than the one gig kit. No, not because it was single channel. I tried both sticks from the dual channel one gig kit out and neither would pas 245mhz. I am going back to get the single sticks.

-Collin-

Well, there's speculation on the chips that were in the previous batches, but the new batches are supposed to be guaranteed BH in the dual kits. I'll let you guys know how it fares in my poor little NF2 rig when it arrives. At least I've got 3.3vdimm to shoot through it (which reminds me that I now need to redo that mod on the g/f's computer if I'm gonna be sticking BH ram in it. Bah ... more work).

PerlAddict said:

Well, there's speculation on the chips that were in the previous batches, but the new batches are supposed to be guaranteed BH in the dual kits. I'll let you guys know how it fares in my poor little NF2 rig when it arrives. At least I've got 3.3vdimm to shoot through it (which reminds me that I now need to redo that mod on the g/f's computer if I'm gonna be sticking BH ram in it. Bah ... more work).

Click to expand...

Like I mentioned earlier....I got one of these Gauranteed BH kits. It did NOT perform as well Wonder what the deal is. I hope yours is better buddy.

-Collin-

NinjaZX6R said:

Like I mentioned earlier....I got one of these Gauranteed BH kits. It did NOT perform as well Wonder what the deal is. I hope yours is better buddy.

-Collin-

Click to expand...

Like I mentioned, these are BH dye, we only tested them for 3200 2-3-3. We did not try overclocking or any higher. We did the same with the single modules which were CH Dye.

Duonger

Duonger said:

Like I mentioned, these are BH dye, we only tested them for 3200 2-3-3. We did not try overclocking or any higher. We did the same with the single modules which were CH Dye.

Duonger

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Understood.....and I don't expect you guys to test any higher. Testing higher would raise the price of the modules, and god knows none of us want that. I didn't mean to sound like I was complaining. I was just pointing out that my luck was better with the single module. I think what you guys are offering is one of the best bargains I have ever come across. Something that ran at 240mhz at cas 2-2-2 was selling for over $300 at one point in time

-Collin-

no i know you werent complaining but i wanted to point this out cuz we are getting calls that the pat isnt performing and when we ask at what spec everyone is saying 245mhz... and asking for an RMA... which is hard to do since they do run at 400 2-3-3 already and 245 is above and beyond.. with the pricing that it is, kingston, corsair and others are selling the same spec about $100 - 120 per 512mb... we did this to give the enthusiast and gamers a great bargain. Trust me, i know that when these run out at frys and outpost, my bosses will bring it back to its regular price of $90-100 bucks...

Duonger

My last question Duonger....and I know you are busy so answer it whenever is convenient....

Does the PCB color matter? I have seen Blue, Black, and Green. All of which appear to be the Brain Power B6U815 PCB. All I can seem to find are the green ones. Is there any difference?

Also, for anyone that wants to see what these modules COULD be capable of....



That is right up there with OCZ PC4000 VX for 119.99.

-Collin-

I'm interested in the PCB color question, too... thanks a lot for the info Duonger!

No it shouldnt matter. They are all Brainpower PCB but just with a different soldermask color. When we mde this deal with Frys they just wanted the parts in the stores asap so I built them up with the boards I had left. Sorry for any confusion but no, the boards do not matter. They are all 815BPB.

Duonger

NinjaZX6R said:

My last question Duonger....and I know you are busy so answer it whenever is convenient....

Does the PCB color matter? I have seen Blue, Black, and Green. All of which appear to be the Brain Power B6U815 PCB. All I can seem to find are the green ones. Is there any difference?

Also, for anyone that wants to see what these modules COULD be capable of....

That is right up there with OCZ PC4000 VX for 119.99.

-Collin-

Click to expand...

Nice clocks bro..... just about on par with my TMSP sticks..... I'll be happy if mine work that good.... they'll be here next week. Yours are the single sticks right? I bought the dual pack that didn't pan out so well for you.

Yep....single sticks. We'll see how yours do. I am a little bummed. I woke up this morning with memtest still running....but not getting any less errors. Still Right about 70 per pass of test 5. I am going to try some more tweaks. I WILL get these stable at 255. No question in my mind

-Collin-

Duonger said:

No it shouldnt matter. They are all Brainpower PCB but just with a different soldermask color. When we mde this deal with Frys they just wanted the parts in the stores asap so I built them up with the boards I had left. Sorry for any confusion but no, the boards do not matter. They are all 815BPB.

Duonger

Click to expand...

Cool, thanks . My two dual packs arrived according to the tracking info and were signed for, can't wait to get home to try 'em out!

hmmm

Curious, how does a "fabless" manufacturer have excess capacity?

Clearly Winbond has something, if nothing else it is ram designs which excell. Infineon paid Winbond over $1BILLION-US for something, I hardly think it was just some chip designs alone.

Infineon never made anything like what Winbond makes/made/contracted/etc or we'd all have it on our good ram list by part number.

Sounds like Infineon bought the designs for BH and CH and certainly FIXED CH, with Infineon expertise/technology, to be what it was originally meant to be.... the successor to BH.

Now I have 1G CH5 (says Winbond CH5 on it) and 1G BH5 (says Winbond BH5 on it) and I have 1G of Twinmos SP alleged to be "UTT".

The SP kicks the living SNOT out of the CH5 and BH5, pure and simple.

At 1T the SP hits (we talking STABLE) 250Mhz 8,2,2,2.0 while the CH5 hits 210Mhz and BH5 hits 205Mhz. At 2T the CH5 hits 235Mhz and BH5 hits 245Mhz, the SP still hits 250Mhz. Thats all at 3.5Vdimm. The BH5 will do 200Mhz 5,2,2,2 1T at lower Vdimm while the SP wont, it needs 3.2Vdimm to start cranking.

I dont give a crap WHAT you call it, whatever is on these sticks is FKing incredible and P-OWNS the previous CH/BH chips on NForce2 machines.

Apprarently BH5 can hold its own against SP on A64 NForce4 boards, but the SP does seem to maybe edge it out at max FSB by a few Mhz on avg.

What we havent seen is what the NEW BH5 does, can it beat the SP(UTT)(VX)(whatever) at max Vdimm? Will 3.5-3.6-3.7V on the new BH5 beat the results for SP/VX/UTT at the same Vdimm's? This is still to be answered.

But at $55/512M stick @Newegg the TwinmosSP is the most ridiculous bargain EVER in DDR. Well, my $9/stick [Officemax sale] Kingston PC2100 valueram (210Mhz 8,3,3,2.5) was actually pretty silly too.

I want more PC's to plug this stuff into. Anyone wanna buy some CH5 (1G $100) and BH5 (1G $200)?